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bags-o-sand

Feb 19, 08 - 4:37 PM

web service

NCRR, not much support for the IDPA guys going on. Do we need to outsource our web support?? (scores)
I know a few good men for the job.

BOS

Mike Wood

Feb 20th, 2008 - 1:34 PM

Re: web service

Lee,
Are you volunteering? Be careful what you wish for.
MW

bags-o-sand

Feb 21st, 2008 - 8:55 AM

Re: web service

Lee this is not, but you've given someone up for
the job. I'm just trying to get a benchmark of my
IDPA performance and the web service as of late isn't
very conducive to the shooters.
JMTCW
BOS

bags-o-sand

Feb 23rd, 2008 - 10:47 AM

Re: web service

Well NCRR and IDPA officials, it's been a full 7 weeks without a posting of scores. That's 6 IDPA matches, 4 bug/rifle matches. Where's the breakdown and lets see if we can rectify.
BOS

Mike Wood

Feb 26th, 2008 - 9:21 PM

Re: web service

The breakdown is the people running the matches (for free) that you & everyone else enjoy shooting so much are getting burnt out after years of donating their personal time. There is a shrinking but extremely dedicated group of people that keep this going and they could use some help. I don't know if you've noticed or not but we're down to only 3 REGULAR RSO's. We need help setting up-tearing down-submitting/planning stages-entering the scores-posting the scores.

As a result of this lack of volunteers we will be cutting back on some of the matches. There will be changes coming up very soon in that regard. I've contacted the webmaster about passing the torch with regard to posting the scores but there needs to be someone qualified & responsible to pick it up. If you have someone in mind, how about emailing me & let me know who they (& you) are.

bags-o-sand

Feb 27th, 2008 - 11:50 AM

Re: web service

Idea: Incentives work, hike the prices up. Take the
difference of the prices and split it up between the workers. That way you're not losing money and you're motivating workers.

Also, fire whomever was directing the classifier this past week or re-train him.

Mike Wood

Feb 28th, 2008 - 2:09 AM

Re: web service

We cannot pay anyone for their work per the clubs rules. It has to do with the IRS/Insurance/OSHA status with us being a not for profit organization.

What was wrong with the classifier? Again the man running the classifier is a volunteer- not getting paid. If you thought there was a problem with it did you even take the time to discuss it with him? If not you did everyone a disservice including yourself.

I've found Card to be fairly open minded if you have a good point. To say we should "Fire Him" sounds extreme & combative, certainly not helpful. You should point out what you thought was wrong and give him a chance to correct it-no matter what it was. We're grateful that he's willing to run these things for you guys. It does however have to be run correctly & exactly per IDPA rules. If it was not you should have discussed it with him.

Instead of just being so critical of Card why don't you start running the clock at the matches to help out and maybe get certified as an IDPA RSO yourself? We need the help. By the way, I'm just assuming your not an RO. It bears mentioning though that it is a tremendous responsibility that you can't fully appreciate until you've done it.

Email me regarding the classifier Sat.

bags-o-sand

Feb 28th, 2008 - 8:18 AM

Re: web service

We're getting well off of topic (web service) but...
I wasn't going to talk policy at the classifier I wanted to check myself. But shooters were being severely penalized for their own mental mistakes, and not being offered the opportunity to re-shoot for weapon malfunctions.
I witnessed 3-3 second penalties on a single string. That's not how I read the rule book. Maybe it's me.

As far as workers "payment" can be in other ways. Surely one can appreciate other forms of "payment."

I'd personally like to thank the vollunteers that put in their time and efforts. Even if the club doesn't appreciate you, the shooters do.

BOS

Alex G

Feb 29th, 2008 - 9:50 AM

Re: web service & more

Bos,

I shot the quallifier 2 months ago and CARD was great! If the people that were shooting when you were there thought their penalties were unfair then they should have said something to CARD about it. AND they could have asked to reshoot the stage, THAT IS in the rule book.

And I talked to Donnie about the scores being posted at last nights match (2-28). Unfortunately there is a single point of failure there as Klaus is the only one in the club with the software to do so and is the only one with authorization to send classifer scores to the IDPA, no excuses there and I do hope they get it resolved soon cause I too like seeing the scores. BUT I have gotten the score sheets from Donnie in the past and I'm sure that he would also send them to anyone when asked.

And on the topic of monetary rewards(pay) for helping at the matches.... I as well as a bunch of others show up early to help set up and tear down, not once have I ever been asked for an entry fee when I or the others do, isn't that enough incentive? I think its a great incentive and I'm not even a member! I personally think they put on a great match even with the limited help. Seems most people just want to mill about in the club house to chat and not stand out in the cold helping out, its understandable but unfair to those that stand out there all night setting up, pasting, working the lights and cleaning up after. Communication and the willingness to help are the keys to solving the problem.

Just my take.
Alex G.

Lord Powell

Mar 1st, 2008 - 1:28 PM

Re: web service

To bags-o-sand:
As keeping track of your IDPA performance why are you looking to some one else to do this for you? Can you not at the end of a match before you leave copy your scores down and keep a running tally? Personally I keep a logbook with my scores, times and penalties, even drawings of the courses of fire, because that’s a way for me to mark my progress. Just a suggestion that works for me; perhaps it may work for you.

Yes it would be nice to see instant scores from the last match posted the next day but as Mike said we are all volunteers, and we give what free time we have with no expectation of payment for the service. Due to our club rules we can have no paid employees. That would open a whole world of no good for the club. Trust me.

I’m not sure what classifier you were at, but I worked beside Card at multiple matches and he puts a lot of time into running matches and classifiers. These matches are a lot of work. Let me say that again. A lot of work. Don’t complain about matches after the fact; if you have an issue with a course of fire or the way an SO is running a match you should bring it up with the SO and the match director. Chastising him anonymously on a message board for volunteering his time to run a match (or the way he runs the match) is not a nice thing to do.

So for my part, I’d like to say: thank you Card for volunteering your time to run matches. I’ll help you out whenever you need.

Lord Powell (Frank Lindsay, 1176)

David Curtin

Mar 4th, 2008 - 9:44 PM

Re: web service

I've shot a classifier and nearly all of the BUG matches run by Card and I think he does a great job. I don't think many of these events would have happened if he hadn't stepped up. THANK YOU CARD!

Klaus

Mar 14th, 2008 - 12:13 PM

Re: web service

Dear BOS.....
Judging by your posts I can think of something other than Bags Of Sand for BOS...but that's another story.

It's a shame that someone that doesn't even have the stones to identify themselves can complain so much. Believe it or not, people have lives outside of these activities. If your world depends on knowing your scores, then I suggest you write them down so you can compare them. Not that it matters, because each weeks stages are different and it would be like comparing apples to oranges. But whatever floats your boat.

I guess your one of those people that pay their money and shoot and then leave, feeling that their $10 entitles them to complain. Everyone that puts on these matches does it for FREE. Actually that's not completely true...it COSTS them time and money to come to the range and set up and run the matches so that complainers can vent because they got a few penalties. If you don't like the penalties, don't make the mistakes. If you read your book....there are no reshoots for gun malfunctions after the first stage. You can however , pay your money again at the classifiers and reshoot the entire 3 stages again...but I guess you missed that part.

Anyway....scores are posted (the ones that I have received) Compare your brains out...

Klaus
(and yes...that's my real name)

ps. "Do we need to outsource our web support?" Until you id yourself, and participate in the volunteering, I do not consider YOU as part of WE. Put up or shut up. Pay your dues.......

MIKE HOILES

Mar 14th, 2008 - 10:26 PM

Re: web service

YA'LL WINE MORE THAN A ROOM FULL OF LIBERALS. JUST FIX THE PROBLEM.

How come the VIR isn't on the IDPA site yet?

I'm busy in case your wondering...NRA Police Tactical 3 Gun this weekend, LA State Match next weekend, Tri-States the weekend after and Badlands next month. Oh yeah, I'm still at AEC.

Ya'll just need to get together and have a group hug,

Mike

Klaus

Mar 15th, 2008 - 1:43 PM

Re: web service

Speaking of whining Mikey.......Your happy tail isn't going to be here....wimp.....so don't tell me what we need to do...tell me in person.....(3-gun....ha.....) LOL

I guess your the one that called the HQ and inquired about it...huh??? LOL Robert called me...they hadn't gotten the check so they weren't listing it until the $$$ arrived....I just put it on my card....it should be there now....**** mail...Tell you the truth...I'm not sure it's the mail.....might be the receiver??? Anyway...have fun....come home with the same number of holes that you went with.....

Klaus

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Author	Comment
bags-o-sand Feb 19, 08 - 4:37 PM	web service NCRR, not much support for the IDPA guys going on. Do we need to outsource our web support?? (scores) I know a few good men for the job. BOS
Mike Wood Feb 20th, 2008 - 1:34 PM	Re: web service Lee, Are you volunteering? Be careful what you wish for. MW Email: mpwood0@cox.net
bags-o-sand Feb 21st, 2008 - 8:55 AM	Re: web service Lee this is not, but you've given someone up for the job. I'm just trying to get a benchmark of my IDPA performance and the web service as of late isn't very conducive to the shooters. JMTCW BOS
bags-o-sand Feb 23rd, 2008 - 10:47 AM	Re: web service Well NCRR and IDPA officials, it's been a full 7 weeks without a posting of scores. That's 6 IDPA matches, 4 bug/rifle matches. Where's the breakdown and lets see if we can rectify. BOS
Mike Wood Feb 26th, 2008 - 9:21 PM	Re: web service The breakdown is the people running the matches (for free) that you & everyone else enjoy shooting so much are getting burnt out after years of donating their personal time. There is a shrinking but extremely dedicated group of people that keep this going and they could use some help. I don't know if you've noticed or not but we're down to only 3 REGULAR RSO's. We need help setting up-tearing down-submitting/planning stages-entering the scores-posting the scores. As a result of this lack of volunteers we will be cutting back on some of the matches. There will be changes coming up very soon in that regard. I've contacted the webmaster about passing the torch with regard to posting the scores but there needs to be someone qualified & responsible to pick it up. If you have someone in mind, how about emailing me & let me know who they (& you) are.
bags-o-sand Feb 27th, 2008 - 11:50 AM	Re: web service Idea: Incentives work, hike the prices up. Take the difference of the prices and split it up between the workers. That way you're not losing money and you're motivating workers. Also, fire whomever was directing the classifier this past week or re-train him.
Mike Wood Feb 28th, 2008 - 2:09 AM	Re: web service We cannot pay anyone for their work per the clubs rules. It has to do with the IRS/Insurance/OSHA status with us being a not for profit organization. What was wrong with the classifier? Again the man running the classifier is a volunteer- not getting paid. If you thought there was a problem with it did you even take the time to discuss it with him? If not you did everyone a disservice including yourself. I've found Card to be fairly open minded if you have a good point. To say we should "Fire Him" sounds extreme & combative, certainly not helpful. You should point out what you thought was wrong and give him a chance to correct it-no matter what it was. We're grateful that he's willing to run these things for you guys. It does however have to be run correctly & exactly per IDPA rules. If it was not you should have discussed it with him. Instead of just being so critical of Card why don't you start running the clock at the matches to help out and maybe get certified as an IDPA RSO yourself? We need the help. By the way, I'm just assuming your not an RO. It bears mentioning though that it is a tremendous responsibility that you can't fully appreciate until you've done it. Email me regarding the classifier Sat.
bags-o-sand Feb 28th, 2008 - 8:18 AM	Re: web service We're getting well off of topic (web service) but... I wasn't going to talk policy at the classifier I wanted to check myself. But shooters were being severely penalized for their own mental mistakes, and not being offered the opportunity to re-shoot for weapon malfunctions. I witnessed 3-3 second penalties on a single string. That's not how I read the rule book. Maybe it's me. As far as workers "payment" can be in other ways. Surely one can appreciate other forms of "payment." I'd personally like to thank the vollunteers that put in their time and efforts. Even if the club doesn't appreciate you, the shooters do. BOS
Alex G Feb 29th, 2008 - 9:50 AM	Re: web service & more Bos, I shot the quallifier 2 months ago and CARD was great! If the people that were shooting when you were there thought their penalties were unfair then they should have said something to CARD about it. AND they could have asked to reshoot the stage, THAT IS in the rule book. And I talked to Donnie about the scores being posted at last nights match (2-28). Unfortunately there is a single point of failure there as Klaus is the only one in the club with the software to do so and is the only one with authorization to send classifer scores to the IDPA, no excuses there and I do hope they get it resolved soon cause I too like seeing the scores. BUT I have gotten the score sheets from Donnie in the past and I'm sure that he would also send them to anyone when asked. And on the topic of monetary rewards(pay) for helping at the matches.... I as well as a bunch of others show up early to help set up and tear down, not once have I ever been asked for an entry fee when I or the others do, isn't that enough incentive? I think its a great incentive and I'm not even a member! I personally think they put on a great match even with the limited help. Seems most people just want to mill about in the club house to chat and not stand out in the cold helping out, its understandable but unfair to those that stand out there all night setting up, pasting, working the lights and cleaning up after. Communication and the willingness to help are the keys to solving the problem. Just my take. Alex G. Email: flippinstk@cox.net
Lord Powell Mar 1st, 2008 - 1:28 PM	Re: web service To bags-o-sand: As keeping track of your IDPA performance why are you looking to some one else to do this for you? Can you not at the end of a match before you leave copy your scores down and keep a running tally? Personally I keep a logbook with my scores, times and penalties, even drawings of the courses of fire, because that’s a way for me to mark my progress. Just a suggestion that works for me; perhaps it may work for you. Yes it would be nice to see instant scores from the last match posted the next day but as Mike said we are all volunteers, and we give what free time we have with no expectation of payment for the service. Due to our club rules we can have no paid employees. That would open a whole world of no good for the club. Trust me. I’m not sure what classifier you were at, but I worked beside Card at multiple matches and he puts a lot of time into running matches and classifiers. These matches are a lot of work. Let me say that again. A lot of work. Don’t complain about matches after the fact; if you have an issue with a course of fire or the way an SO is running a match you should bring it up with the SO and the match director. Chastising him anonymously on a message board for volunteering his time to run a match (or the way he runs the match) is not a nice thing to do. So for my part, I’d like to say: thank you Card for volunteering your time to run matches. I’ll help you out whenever you need. Lord Powell (Frank Lindsay, 1176)
David Curtin Mar 4th, 2008 - 9:44 PM	Re: web service I've shot a classifier and nearly all of the BUG matches run by Card and I think he does a great job. I don't think many of these events would have happened if he hadn't stepped up. THANK YOU CARD! Email: curtin1@cox.net
Klaus Mar 14th, 2008 - 12:13 PM	Re: web service Dear BOS..... Judging by your posts I can think of something other than Bags Of Sand for BOS...but that's another story. It's a shame that someone that doesn't even have the stones to identify themselves can complain so much. Believe it or not, people have lives outside of these activities. If your world depends on knowing your scores, then I suggest you write them down so you can compare them. Not that it matters, because each weeks stages are different and it would be like comparing apples to oranges. But whatever floats your boat. I guess your one of those people that pay their money and shoot and then leave, feeling that their $10 entitles them to complain. Everyone that puts on these matches does it for FREE. Actually that's not completely true...it COSTS them time and money to come to the range and set up and run the matches so that complainers can vent because they got a few penalties. If you don't like the penalties, don't make the mistakes. If you read your book....there are no reshoots for gun malfunctions after the first stage. You can however , pay your money again at the classifiers and reshoot the entire 3 stages again...but I guess you missed that part. Anyway....scores are posted (the ones that I have received) Compare your brains out... Klaus (and yes...that's my real name) ps. "Do we need to outsource our web support?" Until you id yourself, and participate in the volunteering, I do not consider YOU as part of WE. Put up or shut up. Pay your dues.......
MIKE HOILES Mar 14th, 2008 - 10:26 PM	Re: web service YA'LL WINE MORE THAN A ROOM FULL OF LIBERALS. JUST FIX THE PROBLEM. How come the VIR isn't on the IDPA site yet? I'm busy in case your wondering...NRA Police Tactical 3 Gun this weekend, LA State Match next weekend, Tri-States the weekend after and Badlands next month. Oh yeah, I'm still at AEC. Ya'll just need to get together and have a group hug, Mike Email: HOILESM@ATT.NET
Klaus Mar 15th, 2008 - 1:43 PM	Re: web service Speaking of whining Mikey.......Your happy tail isn't going to be here....wimp.....so don't tell me what we need to do...tell me in person.....(3-gun....ha.....) LOL I guess your the one that called the HQ and inquired about it...huh??? LOL Robert called me...they hadn't gotten the check so they weren't listing it until the $$$ arrived....I just put it on my card....it should be there now....**** mail...Tell you the truth...I'm not sure it's the mail.....might be the receiver??? Anyway...have fun....come home with the same number of holes that you went with..... Klaus