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Ginger's Susan Hayward Message Board: To reach If You Knew Susie by Trish Sharp, click the profile photo at www.facebook.com/susanhaywardclassicfilmstar and you will see the link.

Ginger's Susan Hayward Message Board
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Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

Errol,

I have always wondered what happened to poor Troy Donohue, after his very brief career. I had a feeling it wasn't good and felt badly for him. So thank you for sharing your knowledge of him. My interest in people comes, I believe, from studying Psychology at college and reading so much about it. I just think so much about people and how they go through life. And I'm always hoping their lives have happy endings. I have always fought bouts of clinical depression......and I realize that we all have our dark days....and sometimes it is good to 'talk' with others.

And, of course, I love the funny tales you have to tell--they always make me smile!

You know, Errol, I would like to write so much more about Susan---but so few members are here now and seem to have done much of their talking years ago before I knew about the Board. I only just 'discovered' Susan and am full of thoughts and questions. How I wish I was here years ago. I love reading the Archives.

But, rather than losing the few connectiions we have left here on the Board at the moment, I appreciate so much how you try to keep us together.

I think that I am going to be more open and discuss the questions I still have about Susan and her life. I don't want to lose her now!!!

But, as we are such a small group now, I really appreciate your career stories very, very much!! And I do know that your 'first love' is Susan!

I rather believe that Ginger will understand that, during this quiet period on the Board, we still would like to try to stay together!! And I'm certain that Susan would sure miss us!

Thanks, Errol, Lynn

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

By the way....the guy GRACE ROBBINS was 'dating' that was involved in the O.J. SIMPSON murders was...KATO KALAN...I finally remembered his..name!!...

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

Lynn and Errol,
It seems as if whenever I post on the board,I'm somewhat of a wet blanket so
I apologize if it appears I am being one now. Though I could watch Susan in anything-even a Depends commercial-I continue to wonder why she made the role
choices she did in the 60's.I would have HATED to see her retire after winning her Oscar,but I feel her legacy today would have been better if she
had. I understand that when she was under studio contract,she really couldn't
pick and choose her films,but in the 60's she was free to. Why then did she
do films that were not worthy of her talents-especially "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE". We always loved Susan,but that film was trash! Tim has said in the
past that his mother was not good at picking men in her personal life. I
wonder who was advizing her professionally? I my opinion,they did that
great actress no favors than!!

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

Hello everyone,

I am going to throw a spanner in the works here regarding WHERE LOVE HAS GONE as I just adore Susan in it. It IS somewhat of a trashy film BUT she is so gorgeous in it and has so many great scenes that I love it. As we have all said before, Joey Heatherton had such a dreadful tone to her voice and even Bette Davis drove me to distraction with her clipped speech (and I do normally love her) but Susan, to me anyway, was just her wonderful self and the close-ups for her age at the time, were unbelievably good. I never get tired of watching the great Susan in this one.

TRISH

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

Elaine...I totally agree with you on this issue, because 'the choices' were not as good as when she was under contract. BUT..also when she was 'not under contract' you have to remember that was when she also did some of her best roles, (before the 60's)...NEITHER I'LL CRY TOMORROW or I WANT TO LIVE! was when she was under contract to 20th Century Fox. 'TOMORROW'..was MGM and I WANT TO LIVE! was UNITED ARTISTS/FIGRIO.

Ito would have to come from someone who knows more than just what has been reported..on 'why' she chose the roles she did in the '60's..but 'what has been reported' (in more than one place)...is that it had a lot to do with her husband, Eaton Chalkley. HE seemed to only wanting her to do films that took 'THEM' on locations...like Ireland for I THANK A FOOL...England for STOLEN HOURS,
Canada for WOMAN OBSESSED.

Only BACK STREET and THE MARRIAGE-GO-ROUND, WHERE LOVE HAS GONE seem to have been made at the studios here...and it was reported that Susan did 'not' go to Hong Kong while doing SOLDIER OF FORTUNE and her scenes were done at the studio with 'backgrounds' that were shot in Hong Kong and brought back here.

Of course she 'replaced' JUDY GARLAND in VALLEY OF THE DOLLS...and that would have been filmed at the studio..(back at Fox)..but if 'any' Susan film should be called..'trash'...I would think it would be this one. WHERE LOVE HAS GONE is not a 'favorite' of mine, but I would not call it 'trash'. It had two great movie actresses opposite one another...and was based on LANA TURNER's 'trash life'..(and if you don't think that is correct...just read the book..'LANA" which I am now reading..with..OMG..EXPRESSIONS...after each page I have read!
Yes..it was a 'take-off' on Lana's/Cheryl's murder set-up from Harold Robbins book, but it is also based on the 'facts' in Lana's life! THIS FILM was from PARAMOUNT. Someone was going to be playing this 'hot topic' role and I think Susan did it justice!

It is very true..that the films 'after' winning the Oscar went 'down hill' but maybe it was NOT SUSAN'S CHOOSING...rather...someone 'taking control of her life' in more ways than..one! Personally, I happen to not have a lot of 'love' for Mr. Chalkley...and feel we would have seen much better films, if it were not for him. But this was HER LIFE and her love..so this is only for a fan to say!

I am happy we have all the 'great' films that she made...before the '60's..but there were still some good films then too. LOVE.."BACK STREET" no matter what anyone says..that is a darn good film..period...

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

THANKS TRISH...I totally agree..and if it was 'trashy'..it was based on 'real life trashy things'...so I would hope that people would look at this film to be...what it was 'suppose' to be. I do not dislike LANA TURNER, when I say this, but...read..'ANY'..book about her and you will see how 'trashy' things really were...not even with this 'murder thing'.

Sooo surprised...4 abortions (so far in this book)..2 still born children. First abortion was with MICKEY ROONEY..(also JUDY GARLAND...abortion with him) during the ANDY HARDY films...

Going off topic, in a way here..so will STOP! But Susan was truly beautiful in this film and her performance out-shown everyone else in the film.

If you want to talk 'trash movies' go to the 'new ones' that they put out now!!!

I don't even think that when this film was made, that it would have been considered that..'trashy'. BASED ON 'REAL PEOPLE'...gotta remember..where it all started....(then..we get..the real..'trash'...

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

Errol,
I think you are correct-namely,that Eaton Chalkley had great influence,
if not total control,on Susan's choices. Guess love is blind!! I have to
pick your brain,though,you didn't think much of Chalkley....was that during
his marriage to Susan or with the passage of time? We know Tim doesn't
seem to have been fond of him-don't know what Greg's opinion was. As for
"BACK STREET", did you know that originally there was talk of filming it
in Cincinnati which was the setting of the Fannie Hurst book,and of having
Rock Hudson play the John Gavin role. I was growing up in Cincinnati-in
high school than-and the buzz was in the papers at the time. I
always thought that Gavin was a wooden actor. I would have loved to see
Hudson in the role. Of course,Cincinnati hardly possessed the glamour of
New York,Paris,Rome,etc.Needless to say,I was beyond thrilled at the time
at the prospect of Susan filming in my hometown. Would have skipped many
classes to watch that filming....but it was not to be.

By the way,that book you're reading sounds fascinating (trashy).What's
the title and is it new or old?

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

Errol:

Forgive me for correcting you, but Judy never had any romantic inclinations toward Rooney, nor he for her. She had the abortion while married to her first husband, David Rose, and was forced to by the studio and her mother. I've become something of a minor authority on Judy by virtue of reading anything and everythng about her I could get my hands on.

Glad to be back on the board and have enjoyed reading all your comments. Now that I have a wonderful new MacBook Pro laptop I can be more active. Before on my old computer it was quite a chore to do anything without incurring all kinds of problems.

Also, for a full rundown on the Lana/Cheryl affair, Cheryl's book on the subject is a must-read for its truthfulness and poignancy. And I've drawn a blank on the title.

Jill

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

Jill I may be wrong because I think she has written more than one book - I recall reading a Cheryl bio somewhere in the late 80's / early 90's titled 'Detour : A Hollywood Story'.

I think? she actually states that it was she who murdered Stompanato and definitely not her mother ( but again, that is what is written. We are not privy to the definite truth I guess.) From recollection, she claimed he had been appallingly abusing her sexually for some time and that scenario, combined with the threat to Lana that particular night, led to the stabbing.

But in any case I am hoping that may be the book title to which you refer?

Kerry



Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

Elaine...now this is only 'my opinion' on Eaton..from what i have read and seeing him with Susan. He, Tim and Greg were all at the premiere of I'LL CRY TOMORROW at the Pantages Theater in Hollywood, so he was 'in her life' more than I had even realized. Then..if you see the 'full clip' that Tim put on YouTube, when she won the Oscar for I WANT TO LIVE! (IN THE FULL CLIP) it shows he kisses Susan, before she goes running down the aisle to the stage, so he was in her life from 1955 for the Premiere event..and then in 1958 for the Oscar.

Some reporters had said that Susan was finally 'happy' because she had finally found "a man who is in charge..and that is what I have always been looking for." BUT...he was also an alcoholic...which is..what she 'didn't need!' to help her with her own demons. It reminds me of RICHARD CONTE and how he treated SUSAN (as Lillian Roth) in I'LL CRY TOMORROW. NO ONE KNOWS how they fought their 'booze demons' together...and being one, myself, those demons are hard to destroy and get rid of..so you really need A MAN who can steer you 'away' from the things that destroy you..just as Lillian Roth needed..and so many of us do. It is SO EASY..to be lured right back into the 'dark place' that you are trying to pull yourself our of..and every alcoholic knows...what I speak of here.

ALL IN ALL...AS A FAN WHO CARED SO VERY MUCH FOR SUSAN'S WELFARE...I thought it was a 'bad mistake'. Yet...there are reports that she found' some happiness' with him. To me...he will always be a RICHARD CONTE type shown in that film..Not really 'helping'..rather 'pulling her into 'the dark place' even more. BUT...Susan had to have loved him, because she refused to stay in VENICE (another 'on location filming') to finish THE HONEY POT and said even if she was to be taken out of the film..she was going home to be with her very ill husband...who needed her. Of course, he took ill while in Venice with her and then later died..after going back home.

ON THE LANA TURNER BOOK...The book is simply called..."LANA THE LIFE AND LOVES OF LANA TURNER" written by JANE ELLEN WAYNE (who has written books on other stars including AVA GARDNER's "AVA'S MEN", "STANWYCK", "GABLE'S WOMEN", "KINGS OF TRAGEDY", "THE LIFE AND LOVES OF GRACE KELLY", "ROBERT TAYLOR THE MAN WITH THE PERFECT FACE", "CLARK GABLE PORTRAIT OF A MISFIT", "COOPERS WOMEN", "MARILYN'S MEN" and "AVA'S MEN".

The LANA TURNER book was written in 1995....
They are all through ST. MARTINS PRESS in NEW YORK

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

Hi Jill...glad you are back on the 'board'....and happy that you chat with me 'on the side' at my email address, which everyone can do.

Jill..I am only going on what is reported in this book I am reading, who says that Judy was heartbroken when Mickey took up with Lana and did not want to tell Mickey that she was pregnant.

From this book...it says that Judy never told Mickey that she had the abortion. Then a quote from Mickey Rooney...saying he never knew about it until after it was all over with..and had he known, he would have NOT wanted to have had the abortion. It was not the same with Lana..when he found out that she was pregnant.

Sooo...maybe this writer is not telling the 'whole truth' but that is in the book.

She also goes on to tell how Cheryl finally had to tell Lana that husband LEX BARKER was forcing her to have sex with him all the time they were married and that is what ended their marriage. Cheryl didn't even 'dare' tell her mother, to she told her grandmother, Mildred, who in turn told Lana.

They were BOTH cheating on one another..Lana was never without men on the side and this was LEX's second marriage..the first ending because of being caught by his wife, (finally) with another woman and then knew that all the other 'affairs' were real too.

I have only reported what I am now reading in this book, so HOW would I know? I wasn't even....THERE....(lol)...

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

Kerry...the book DETOUR you are referring to, is also mentioned in this book, but I am just at that point now, so not sure what it says in this book. However it does say that 'neither' of Lana and Cheryl's testimony were 'the same' and there was big reason to KNOW that one of them was truly lying about the murder.

CHERYL..says when the door opened to the bedroom she had the knife in her hand and he ran into the knife..and it was just an accident. Another version (Lana's I think it was...because mother MILDRED had a version too and she wasn't even there)...but this 'other version' was that he was on He and Lana fought on the bed and that Lana had the knife..thus killing him!

I...feel..that it is another Hollywood murder that will never be completely revealed. Just like MARILYN MONROE, O.J. SIMPSON, (well I don't doubt much on this one..I think HE DID THEM), JEFFREY HUNTER, NICK ADAMS, BOBBY DARIN and the ROBERT BLAKE case. .....

Re: "WHERE LOVE HAS GONE"..FOR BIRTHDAY NIGHT..

First off -- hi Kerry. It's been a while. Nice to chat with you again.

Yes, the book title was "Detour..." I thought of it naturally after I posted my message. And I think it was the only one she wrote.

According to her book, there were never any abuse issues with Stompanato -- she was just defending her mother. I believe her account. The abuse came from Lex Barker when she was little. She mentions an ugly incident that occurred, which made me sick when I read it. What a creep.

I truly believe Cheryl's account of that night -- maybe because I had to defend my own mother more times than I care to remember. But I guess we bring our own experience to things we read and our feelings are colored by this personal history. I could identify with Cheryl and that is why I believe her. Plus, I don't think she had anything to gain by lying.

Anyway, never thought this subject would create so much interest on the board.

Jill